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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hello! ... Just purchased an 07 CBR 1000RR that has had it's head gasket replaced. Upon putting the motor back in, it is failing to get spark.

Things I've checked and confirmed working:

BAS (Bank Angle Sensor / Tip Sensor) - Jumped (Pin 1 and 3) / Confirmed by un-jumping and trying to start in neutral. Fuel pump does not prime, Does not crank.
Kickstand Switch - Jumped (Pin 1 and 2) / Confirmed by unjumping, and trying to start in gear with clutch pulled. Does not crank.
Neutral Safety Switch - Confirmed by green N on cluster
Clutch Switch - Confirmed by trying to start in gear with clutch pulled in. Cranks, but no start. Will not crank with lever out.
Injectors + Fuel - Confirmed by removing airbox and physically watching the bottom 4 injectors spray while it tries to start.
Fuses + Relays - All good, including the 20amp by the battery. Also the diode in the fuse box up front is good.
% CKP Sensor - I removed this sensor from the left of the head and found like 2 or 3 tiny metal shavings on it. (Apparently common due to the cam gear clearance being so close and can expand/move due to heat.) Cleaned off and reinstalled, and checked continuity while cranking and saw it fluctuating.
% Pulse Generator - I removed this sensor from the clutch cover, checked continuity while placing metal in front of the magnet and saw it fluctuating. Reinstalled, and tested for continuity back to the ECU which appeared good. (This and the CKP sensor are hard to test as it's a HALL sensor with a square signal that my multimeter cannot read)
X Spark - No spark confirmed by grounding plug on frame while trying to start. Plugs look practically brand new, along with boots. Have tried swapping plugs and boots around.

I have pulled the DTC codes by shorting the DLC (Data Link Connector) pins (green and brown) and the only code thrown is 35 (EGCA Malfunction due to aftermarket exhaust) which says it will still start regardless.

Concerns: My cluster says "HESD" on it, although it's plugged in. Not sure if that's normal behavior or not.

But yeah, overall everything appears working.. Including brake switch, speed sensor, etc... Just no spark!

Any ideas? The bike is connected to a battery charger while testing. The only thing I can think is to try swapping out the ECU, and finding a way to confirm the CKP / Pulse Generator are actually good and working. I do have 12V on the black/white stripe wire that goes to each coil pack. The ECU just isn't grounding when it's time to spark.
 

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This is a copy of the page 18-4 from the service manual:
sounds like you've done many of these but in case:

262587
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Yes, I'm assuming there could be a break in harness or short in the ecu or hopefully something I am just overlooking. I'm not very familiar with these
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 · (Edited)
Okay little update today.. Took my OHM meter out and measured for continuity between the ECU and the CKP (Crankshaft Position Sensor / Pulse Generator), and the ECU to the CMP (Camshaft Position Sensor)

CKP (Crankshaft Position Sensor) / Pulse GeneratorCMP (Camshaft Position Sensor) / Pulsar ASSY.VSS (Vehicle Speed Sensor)
262594
262596
262595

and everything showed good continuity to the corresponding pins on the ECU... So no break in the harness for those... Getting worried it's the ECU. I guess I will check all the other components that the ECU needs to see to ground these sensors... But doubt it's those since I've confirmed them working as expected.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 · (Edited)
Just now learning that the bike will try to crank without the computer plugged in at all... Is that normal behavior? The only difference I see is no fuel being injected, and no prime, no HESD on the dash, and no error codes flashing but MIL lamp is on.


EDIT: After plugging the computer back in and testing a different coil, I saw a single spark on the plug. Even felt it a little too. I have yet to recreate this though.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Okay after experimenting some more I have discovered that I have "occasional" spark.... It is very strange... I have tried different boots, different plugs, and it only is sparking 1 time about every ~10 revolutions... And at this time, I am unable to get it to spark at all. VERY strange I have never seen anything like it. I have tried moving the harness around and it changes nothing. I don't believe there to be a short anywhere with the spark plug harness.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 · (Edited)
I have it hooked up to a jumper, and voltage is staying good while cranking. Wondering if stator/rectifier needs to be hooked up to help with spark... Doubt it as I've read a lot of people having success with no stator plugged in at all. It's so weird, it seems like hit or miss if I get spark or not now. Can't figure out what is causing it to spark, vs not spark.

EDIT: I also have tested my spark plugs in a weed eater and they are working fine in it
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 · (Edited)
Any ideas guys? I have measured primary and secondary resistance on my OEM Denso coils and getting 1.5ohms on primary and ~13.20k on secondary. All seem good.. Plugs also all working. Just seems like the ECU wants to ground them out very sparingly.. I actually haven't been able to get spark again since seeing it yesterday. Shaking harness while trying, etc.. I even tried shifting the crank sensor forward/ back with washers just to make sure it was lined up with the crank gear and no difference there.. I pulled the crank sensor out and measured ohms on it while waving metal infront of the magnet and it would go from 480ohms up to ~1.1, and also down to 200 real fast then reset back to 480... Which I assume is normal behavior for a working sensor

EDIT: I have tested continuity for the CKPsensor and the CMP sensor all the way to the ECU. 0 Resistance/continuity on both wires for both sensors (While shaking all parts of the harness around to look for shorts/breaks).. I just can't for the life of me understand how I had spark and now it's just magically gone.
 

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@Lej

I'm guessing others are not resounding because they don't have an answer, not because they are ignoring.

I think this is the best recent troubleshooting thread on this topic. You sound like a very detailed and capable person. Please keep posting.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 · (Edited)
Well the best I have for today is that I have 12v across all coil packs, but when cranking, I don't get voltages anywhere near 100v. (Meter in DC, not AC?)... Which the FSM states if I have 12v initial voltage, and no peak voltage when cranking... That it's a bad ECM. Hopefully I am testing the coils correctly? I am just unplugged a coil pack, and putting one probe on the negative side of the battery, and putting the other on the 12v line on the coil pack connector. It just drops to like 11.9 when cranking. I don't see any 100v+ numbers. Is this correct? Can anyone confirm on their coil pack? Also looking for confirmation on cam / crank reference signal voltage.. FSM states .7v minimum?
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 · (Edited)
Okay little update... Didn't realize I needed to be checking for .7v AC not DC. Put my meter in AC and tested the crank sensor (pulse generator on the right clutch cover).. And got above .7v AC. Tested the pins on the ecu with the sensor replugged in to make sure the <.7v ac was getting all the way to the ECU and it was... Did the same thing for the cam sensor, and I am only getting .2v AC... So I took the sensor out and put a screw up to the magnet and pulled away, and got way over .7v AC (Like ~1.3v AC) .. So the sensor appears to be working, but perhaps the cam gear isn't close enough or something may be going on there. It could still be the sensor not being sensitive enough.

But from my understanding, the cam sensor has nothing to do with spark according to the FSM.. Only fuel (Although I know the two go hand-in-hand) .... It would be awesome if someone could test unplugged their cam sensor from the harness, and seeing if they still have spark or their bike still starts. Or if someone just knows the cam sensor is 100% needed for spark.

I will report back once I do a little more testing.

EDIT: Just wanted to report that I am NOT getting cam/crank sensor error codes with them unplugged and trying to crank. Leading me to believe the ECU is at fault still
 

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Be advised the bike won't start or fire if the HESD isnt connected and working properly . I know guys that remove it for some reasons beyond me. And the bike won't fire with them. All start up procedures run thru the hesd . It's one of a kind and works great when hooked . Lol
 

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Shot in the dark but worth trying.... wiggle the wires under the kill switch and try to fire the bike. Even if u have taken it apart. The sodder inside weakens the connection that completes the electrical circuit for starting.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
Yeah I considered looking into the HESD issue but it shows it should still get spark, but the bike would essentially be in limp mode.
262639


And yep I wiggled the fuse boxes, random areas on the harness.. and took the kill switch apart and checked it out and it looks great. Fuel pump also primes no problem.. I am almost convinced it's the ECU due to it not even throwing codes for the sensors when they are unplugged. That tells me some components/traces on the ECU board must be stuck open/burned or who knows.. Maybe I'm wrong.. Either way new ECU should be in soon and I'll update.. Until then can anyone confirm that they get codes with cam/crank unplugged and trying to start? Or if they can start without the cam sensor (top of head) plugged in?
 

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Hey I was skimming though this sorry if I asked a question already talked about. Did you check all the grounds on the motor? You said you pulled it for the head gasket I’d check all the grounds. working in the automotive industry I’ve seen people start the fastener for the ground but not tighten it up.
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
Good question that I didn't mention anything about. Yes so the main pack of grounds with all the green wires and 2 metal rings that a bolt holds in place are good. And then both little yellow boxes are in great condition. No rust or corrosion. And then the battery is grounded to the block right by the starter and it's tight. That's the only major ones I know about.

My new ecm and pulse generator sensor will be in soon and I'll update
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
Alright got the new computer in and hooked it up. Still no spark, and it wasn't showing any codes at first, but after the first crank, I had the same code for my exhaust servo motor thing. No big deal there. So still waiting for my crank sensor to come in... It's hard to test, but it doesn't look like I am getting the .7v ac off the crank sensor as of right now.
 

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Hello! ... Just purchased an 07 CBR 1000RR that has had it's head gasket replaced. Upon putting the motor back in, it is failing to get spark.

Things I've checked and confirmed working:

BAS (Bank Angle Sensor / Tip Sensor) - Jumped (Pin 1 and 3) / Confirmed by un-jumping and trying to start in neutral. Fuel pump does not prime, Does not crank.
Kickstand Switch - Jumped (Pin 1 and 2) / Confirmed by unjumping, and trying to start in gear with clutch pulled. Does not crank.
Neutral Safety Switch - Confirmed by green N on cluster
Clutch Switch - Confirmed by trying to start in gear with clutch pulled in. Cranks, but no start. Will not crank with lever out.
Injectors + Fuel - Confirmed by removing airbox and physically watching the bottom 4 injectors spray while it tries to start.
Fuses + Relays - All good, including the 20amp by the battery. Also the diode in the fuse box up front is good.
% CKP Sensor - I removed this sensor from the left of the head and found like 2 or 3 tiny metal shavings on it. (Apparently common due to the cam gear clearance being so close and can expand/move due to heat.) Cleaned off and reinstalled, and checked continuity while cranking and saw it fluctuating.
% Pulse Generator - I removed this sensor from the clutch cover, checked continuity while placing metal in front of the magnet and saw it fluctuating. Reinstalled, and tested for continuity back to the ECU which appeared good. (This and the CKP sensor are hard to test as it's a HALL sensor with a square signal that my multimeter cannot read)
X Spark - No spark confirmed by grounding plug on frame while trying to start. Plugs look practically brand new, along with boots. Have tried swapping plugs and boots around.

I have pulled the DTC codes by shorting the DLC (Data Link Connector) pins (green and brown) and the only code thrown is 35 (EGCA Malfunction due to aftermarket exhaust) which says it will still start regardless.

Concerns: My cluster says "HESD" on it, although it's plugged in. Not sure if that's normal behavior or not.

But yeah, overall everything appears working.. Including brake switch, speed sensor, etc... Just no spark!

Any ideas? The bike is connected to a battery charger while testing. The only thing I can think is to try swapping out the ECU, and finding a way to confirm the CKP / Pulse Generator are actually good and working. I do have 12V on the black/white stripe wire that goes to each coil pack. The ECU just isn't grounding when it's time to spark.
make sure your bank angle sensor is the right way up! I had an issue were I replaced the fuel pump and it would not prime due to that simple reason. Mine was simply upside down and once I realized the error it was corrected and it primed right up.
 
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