Sounds interesting, I would like to take a look if you can send me the bin file.Also I've spend quite a bit of time making my own EVT table. I've used bilinear interpolation methods and python scripts to get something that is smooth on low throttle and still has 100% on full throttle. Let me know if you guys wanna try it out.
So I was able to fix the super harsh wheelie control intervention by copying the WC values from a different bin file. My map is on the mapshare and with those WC values the bikes wheelie control works the same as it did when stock. Lets you hold the front wheel for a bit, gently lets the front end down. You can see it in action below at:I have the same issue, I've contacted Wooich and they gave me some caned response and refused to help. I have also noticed that the cut-off are really harsh. I was able accelerate really hard in first and keep the front from going any higher than maybe a foot off the ground. Now, when I do that that (even though there is suppose to be 0 intervention, it cuts out harshly. Its also very random. Sometimes it will let me keep it going for like 1-2 second before it cuts, and sometimes it cuts out immediately.
I have a feeling the flash really messes with TC, not to mention they had that bug in the software that made the bike borderline dangerous. They said they fixed it, (and it looks like it is) but I think there are still some things fucky that we aren't aware of.
Let me know if your solution (setting WC1 to all 0) works.
Have you tried it out yet? How do you like it?Also I've spend quite a bit of time making my own EVT table. I've used bilinear interpolation methods and python scripts to get something that is smooth on low throttle and still has 100% on full throttle. Let me know if you guys wanna try it out.
Ya I've tried, it I did like 30 iterations on it. Id go for a ride and make notes on where its good or bad, the go back and adjust and reflash.Have you tried it out yet? How do you like it?
I'm in Singapore for work right now and won't be back stateside until March 11 so sadly I can't do any testing until then.
"Raptor from this it looks like your map would hit softer almost everywhere". That the whole point. I don't want it to hit hard, on low throttle application. I want it to be smooth and have a gradual increase in power as you roll on the throttle. Also this view makes it look worse than it is.This is the percent difference of the Euro map vs Raptors map, gear 5. a "-10" (red) value means Raptors map
delivers 10% less throttle for the same throttle position and rpm vs the Euro map.
Raptor from this it looks like your map would hit softer almost everywhere except in the upper right corner of the table, a place where I avoid when riding.
View attachment 261884
How does it feel?
This EVT map has no affect on engine power output is simply maps YOUR throttle input to ACTUAL throttle input (or valve opening). The reason the upper right is so much more in my map is because these bikes already have low power on low rpm. If for some reason I wack it at 4500RPM I want the bike give me power and not like 40% where the OEM is at. The engine power output drastically increases from lower rpms so that's why its still not 100% but it gets there by at 6000RPM.Raptor from this it looks like your map would hit softer almost everywhere except in the upper right corner of the table, a place where I avoid when riding.
I missed that part about only copying the bottom-most table. Whoops, I'll try that later today.This EVT map has no affect on engine power output is simply maps YOUR throttle input to ACTUAL throttle input (or valve opening). The reason the upper right is so much more in my map is because these bikes already have low power on low rpm. If for some reason I wack it at 4500RPM I want the bike give me power and not like 40% where the OEM is at. The engine power output drastically increases from lower rpms so that's why its still not 100% but it gets there by at 6000RPM.
View attachment 261890
The reason this section is almost unchanged is, well, because you can't do much here. She's giving it all she's got, on OEM and my map.
View attachment 261891
Imagine you're mid corner at 6000rpm, you just hit the apex, you start to roll on the throttle to 100% as you straighten your bike up.
View attachment 261892
From this heat map you an tell how my map will be different from OEM. At off throttle position, mine will have less engine braking. As you start rolling on the throttle mine will give less. What this means is that you have to twist MORE to get same power as OEM. This also means that you physically have more range of motion in the throttle for the for the 0-20% valve opening. This means smoother and less twitchy input at low throttle.
As long as 0 throttle is maps to 0 (or in this case near 0 because of engine braking) and 100% throttle maps to 100%, you're not gonna loose any power, you're simply changing how much throlle you twist to get the desired power in between.
This is called interpolation and its used in many places. Like computer graphics and animation. This is an example of interpolation methods used for animations in computer graphics.
View attachment 261893
As you can see all the graphs start at 0 and end up at 100. However the interpolation method, affects what the output (y-axis) looks like in between (x-axis).
What you are looking at above is the difference between the stock USA nerfed ETV table and your custom ETV table. A better comparison is Euro unrestricted ETV vs your custom ETV table as can be seen below for gear 5:
People get quick-turn throttles to reach full power will less wrist twist (45degress vs Oem 65 degrees). This is that that they don't have to twist or reposition the wrist so much. Yes, this also means that it takes less throttle degrees to reach (for example 50% valve opening). But that's not a pro, that's con. If you google "quick throttle vs stock throttle" you will get a lot of people listing the throttle is more twitchy as a side affect.And I get your point about if 0 is 0 and 100 is 100, you don't lose power, but in the real world that's not true, most people spend a lot of time at partial throttle when in the canyons and on track. During those times they will be making less power if the ETV map is super soft vs aggressive. It's why quick turn throttles were so popular for cable-actuates bikes. You have basically made a slow-turn throttle.
I understand that is subjective. Just like a quick-throttle.That's true the twist-grip range of motion has stayed constant so it's not a perfect analogy, but as you admit your map does require significantly more twist grip action to achieve the same throttle position (for the most part), like going to a slower turn throttle would do. I'm not saying that's a bad thing I'm just not convinced it's a good thing.
I have never heard anyone argue that they want to have to turn their throttle twice as far to get the same throttle opening. You tout that as a benefit but personally I have no issues with throttle modulation off bottom. I want my throttle more linear. If someone does have that issue though then they will probably like your tune.
I also fly model helicopters and airplanes, and in that hobby a lot of people use substantial amounts of expo (exponential) when setting their pitch and roll curves, to reduce sensitivity near mid-stick. For example I used to fly at a field with a bunch of old guys. One of the guys let me fly his tiny model F-22 that he was having trouble with. I flew it and hated it because he had the expo turned up so high that I had to move the stick really far to get it to do what I wanted. I turned the expo down and then it flew really nice. The old guy tried it with my setup and he hated it, was twitching all over the place.
So my point is that some people like a lot of expo, some like a little. I personally use very little to no expo because I like having a very responsive vehicle. No right or wrong answer though it's just preference.
That is why I keep asking for your subjective opinion, we can look at graphs all day long but all that matters is how it feels to ride, after 30 iterations, does it feel good? Have you tried the Euro map back to back?
About your last plot that is not what I am saying at all
Which is just plain wrong.During those times they will be making less power
Yes, I like it. That's why I'm sharing it and asking others to try it and see what they think.does it feel good?
They will make less power if they open the throttle the same amount, again, not necessarily a bad thing.I understand that is subjective. Just like a quick-throttle.
But then you go and say things like
Which is just plain wrong.
Yes, I like it. That's why I'm sharing it and asking others to try it and see what they think.
Ya, its not that bad above 10-20%.They will make less power if they open the throttle the same amount, again, not necessarily a bad thing.
I'll be sure to try it out when I get back to the States.
BTW here is Euro vs yours, for 9000 rpms, 5th gear. What's interesting is that the Euro map IS very close to linear for certain conditions. For example, ask for 25%, it gives you 25%, ask for 50%, it gives you 50%, etc.
View attachment 261904
You mean 165 rwhp . It's OK we know the CBR is down on power compared to the other 1000's. Step one is acceptanceThe throttle is how the power is made available to the bike, so the ETV tables are the power management interface - This map will make the bike effectively much slower than even a stock Euro bike on track.
Honda already paired the system with a very effective TC/WC system to allow the rider to access as much power as they want to get at (ETV tables permitting) and then if too much is on tap and the bike begins to waste energy rotating about the rear axle it gently puts the front wheel down by closing the throttle on you and you just keep holding the throttle open because once the wheel is settled, the bike puts throttle back where you have it.. or if the wheel begins to slip it reduces throttle just enough to mitigate slip then gives you back what you are asking for.
The downside with forcing the rider to wind the throttle up to get the power down is that they will almost always dial in more wrist than they needed to and you get a "nothing, nothing nothingggg. noooooothing... BAM!!! here is the power you asked for" power delivery. And with 180rwhp coming online like that, the chassis might be prone to abruptly spin up/hoist the front wheel and force the TC/WC to abruptly intervene rather than smoothly come online.
BTW: the throttle action, independent of the ETV tables is already non-linear; internally there is not a 1:1 relationship between the throttle grip angle and the throttle position sensor of the throttle blade, so while your logic and math is spot on, in this case the throttle action has been slowed down considerably.
As noted, see the Euro ETV table.
Rated 189bhp at the engine, which is not that much down on power compared to 17-19 contemporary 1000s (6hp to 11hp diff.), even stock 165rwhp would mean 13% drive train loss to friction - a rather high number for a motorcycle.You mean 165 rwhp . It's OK we know the CBR is down on power compared to the other 1000's. Step one is acceptance